Iterate on draft blog post (monthly update feb 2023) #175

The most difficult part is ahead: getting an agreement so it can be published. It is very different from publishing a technical documentation because it is written in the name of the entire Forgejo community. And as such must be agreed upon. I don't think there is a need to go through the decision making process. But there definitely is a need to make sure the majority of Forgejo contributors who participated in February had a chance to review and express their concerns.

A few minor changes, otherwise looks good. It is great that you're willing to work on that. The most difficult part is ahead: getting an agreement so it can be published. It is very different from publishing a technical documentation because it is written in the name of the entire Forgejo community. And as such must be agreed upon. I don't think there is a need to go through the decision making process. But there definitely is a need to make sure the majority of Forgejo contributors who participated in February had a chance to review and express their concerns.

👍 1

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				Each headline now shows a `#` that you can use to link deep into your favourite

				part of our website. We took special care to mark up these links to be friendly

				to our pals that use assistive technology. They belong into tech as well.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:16:00 +00:00

Poster

Hm, I change it to „ally” now. That term is used in the inclusive community (CC @fsologureng). Usually for people with privileges that side with minority groups.

I'm open for suggestions.

Hm, I change it to „ally” now. That term is used in the inclusive community (CC @fsologureng). Usually for people with privileges that side with minority groups. I'm open for suggestions.

fsologureng commented

2023-03-10 15:13:10 +00:00

I would use: We have taken special care to make these links accessible".

I am not comfortable using "ally" because it is not what I would expect from all readers of this website. The readership is usually larger than those involved in the development or use of the software.

I would use: We have taken special care to make these links accessible". I am not comfortable using "ally" because it is not what I would expect from all readers of this website. The readership is usually larger than those involved in the development or use of the software.

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

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				internationalization or maintainability in general, we will welcome you with

				open arms.

				### Privacy headers

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:31:57 +00:00

Poster

Done.

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

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				process and communicating properly when a problem happens is what

				Forgejo users expect and deserve.

				A new FreeBSD team was established and our social account team extended.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:19:02 +00:00

Poster

I was referring to forgejo/meta#159

I was referring to https://codeberg.org/forgejo/meta/pulls/159

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:47:36 +00:00

Poster

So . we need an issue for that to legitimise it?
I'm still not up-to-date with our processes :(

So . we need an issue for that to legitimise it? I'm still not up-to-date with our processes :(

👍 1

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

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				aggressive comments disrupting communications and creating tensions. It

				went on during weeks and the interim moderation team was not prepared

				to handle the challenge. In fact, at this point the moderation team is

				effectively disbanded. We hope to reestablish it as soon as possible.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:21:13 +00:00

Poster

I see what you mean. My idea was that a disbanded moderation team could be interpreted at no moderation happening at all. And that the Forgejo community would be fine with it. That's not what should come across.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:32:16 +00:00

Poster

Rephrased.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 11:15:25 +00:00

Poster

I'd like to have another pair on eyes on this.
No offense, but I feel like you are to emotionally involved in this.

I'd like to have another pair on eyes on this. No offense, but I feel like you are to emotionally involved in this.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 19:08:46 +00:00

Poster

@dachary I feel pushed to do as you wish by your actions. I don't understand why you try to steer everything in your way. If someone criticies your actions you write back ad hominem. This is not the way I want to discuss things.
However, a PR comment thread is not the right place to get into the details.

My line of thought is this:

There was an event and moderation could not handle this.
This might encourage people to try again on trolling us.
Looking up the moderation team on the meta repo is showing (none).
Does that mean, the trolls won? Do we not care about moderation anymore?

With the sentences I added compared to your blog post I want to highlight that we did not give up. But end of February left us in a more vulnerable position than ever before.

@dachary I feel pushed to do as you wish by your actions. I don't understand why you try to steer everything in your way. If someone criticies your actions you write back ad hominem. This is not the way I want to discuss things. However, a PR comment thread is not the right place to get into the details. My line of thought is this: 1. There was an event and moderation could not handle this. 2. This might encourage people to try again on trolling us. 3. Looking up the moderation team on the meta repo is showing `(none)`. 4. Does that mean, the trolls won? Do we not care about moderation anymore? With the sentences I added compared to your blog post I want to highlight that we did not give up. But end of February left us in a more vulnerable position than ever before.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-14 17:57:18 +00:00

Poster

I agree with the tension part, but disagree with the inflammatory comments. Those don't originate with me.

I am confused as to why this is marked as solved. It is anything but. I already highlighted that I won't be able to get back to this for a few days.

I already sent proof and explanation to Dachary.
Obviously he didn't bother to copy them over here even after I told him that I would permit it. So much to radical transparency.

Therefore I repeat what I wrote him here.

I don't understand why you try to steer everything in your way.

This is a reference to forgejo/meta#187 among other things. Instead of waiting for consensus, I feel that the community is hijacked to forgejo-contrib.
Comments that speak against the move such as forgejo/meta#187 (comment) are ignored.

Forgejo-contrib is meant to be an incubator. Repos there are to be archived or moved into forgejo after a few weeks. I'm yet to see that happen.
forgejo-contrib/governance#8 is closed by now.

I would expect issues to be opened against meta. Instead meta acts as a second-hand mirror for another repository in the forgejo-contrib org now. That's not how it is meant to work.

it created an environment so hostile for me that I had lost hope and saw no other option but to leave.

as well as the latest recorded governance meeting with „I feel emotionally insecure” make me believe that

I feel like you are to emotionally involved in this.

In fact, I would like to see dachary actually moving away until his vacation later this month is over. This can be seen as a burnout or extended vacation.
I'm acting in good faith here.

Instead I receive a response like

I do not speculate on your state of mind and I would appreciate if you do not speculate on mine.

Speculating on one's state of mind sounds like I'd assume a mental illness. This led me to write

If someone criticies your actions you write back ad hominem.

Instead of talking about the matter (you feel insecure), you have chosen aggressive wording.
Yet I'm the one being accussed of being inflammatory. I demand to learn why.

I was told that my words are perceived as a slander. I don't understand why and will not accept that until I receive an explanation.

I agree with the tension part, but disagree with the inflammatory comments. Those don't originate with me. I am confused as to why this is marked as solved. It is anything but. I already highlighted that I won't be able to get back to this for a few days. --- I already sent proof and explanation to Dachary. Obviously he didn't bother to copy them over here even after I told him that I would permit it. So much to radical transparency. Therefore I repeat what I wrote him here. > I don't understand why you try to steer everything in your way. This is a reference to https://codeberg.org/forgejo/meta/issues/187 among other things. Instead of waiting for consensus, I feel that the community is hijacked to forgejo-contrib. Comments that speak against the move such as https://codeberg.org/forgejo/meta/issues/187#issuecomment-824219 are ignored. Forgejo-contrib is meant to be an incubator. Repos there are to be archived or moved into forgejo after a few weeks. I'm yet to see that happen. https://codeberg.org/forgejo-contrib/governance/issues/8 is closed by now. I would expect issues to be opened against meta. Instead meta acts as a second-hand mirror for another repository in the forgejo-contrib org now. That's not how it is meant to work. > it created an environment so hostile for me that I had lost hope and saw no other option but to leave. as well as the latest recorded governance meeting with „I feel emotionally insecure” make me believe that > I feel like you are to emotionally involved in this. In fact, I would like to see dachary actually moving away until his vacation later this month is over. This can be seen as a burnout or extended vacation. I'm acting in good faith here. Instead I receive a response like > I do not speculate on your state of mind and I would appreciate if you do not speculate on mine. Speculating on one's state of mind sounds like I'd assume a mental illness. This led me to write > If someone criticies your actions you write back ad hominem. Instead of talking about the matter (you feel insecure), you have chosen aggressive wording. Yet I'm the one being accussed of being inflammatory. I demand to learn why. I was told that my words are perceived as a slander. I don't understand why and will not accept that until I receive an explanation.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-04-03 10:55:26 +00:00

Poster

I thought long and hard about what to do here.
As you can guess, there were additional comments in between. The respective authors have chosen to delete them. I will respect their decision.

That being said, I value the conversation here as a public record. Therefore I am not going to update mine. I also encourage you to look at the commits to understand how the section in question developed over time.

I thought long and hard about what to do here. As you can guess, there were additional comments in between. The respective authors have chosen to delete them. I will respect their decision. That being said, I value the conversation here as a public record. Therefore I am not going to update mine. I also encourage you to look at the commits to understand how the section in question developed over time.

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				safe space and organize moderation to efficiently and quickly put an

				end to the most toxic behaviors.

				### Awesome Selfhosted candidate

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:24:03 +00:00

Poster

Right. The update happened on March 1st.
Off-by-one.

https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted/pull/3467

Right. The update happened on March 1st. Off-by-one. https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted/pull/3467

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:32:28 +00:00

Poster

Removed.

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

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				This way, even more people can learn about what we are building here together.

				Thank you for that! Keep it going.

				## What's next?

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:26:06 +00:00

Poster

I see what you mean.

My intention to have some kind of „conclusion” as I am used to it in a blog post format.

As such I was hoping to not end on a bad note.

Then the grants are not finalised (except yours for F3 MoU in March). So it has a future aspect to it.

I see what you mean. My intention to have some kind of „conclusion” as I am used to it in a blog post format. As such I was hoping to not end on a bad note. Then the grants are not finalised (except yours for F3 MoU in March). So it has a future aspect to it.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:30:55 +00:00

Poster

@crystal and @earl-warren I pushed an update here on this section.
Would like to get your opinion on whether I got the details right.
Remember that I want to refer to the state of February.

Thanks in advance!

@crystal and @earl-warren I pushed an update here on this section. Would like to get your opinion on whether I got the details right. Remember that I want to refer to the state of February. Thanks in advance!

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 10:48:20 +00:00

Poster

I did not mention it (since it didn't show up in our funding/sustainability repo).
But that's the first accepted grant of this year that I'm aware of.

I did not mention it (since it didn't show up in our funding/sustainability repo). But that's the first accepted grant of this year that I'm aware of.

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

Ryuno-Ki requested review from dachary 2023-03-10 10:32:43 +00:00

Ryuno-Ki requested review from crystal 2023-03-10 10:32:54 +00:00

Ryuno-Ki requested review from earl-warren 2023-03-10 10:32:55 +00:00

dachary requested changes 2023-03-10 11:10:38 +00:00

Dismissed

dachary left a comment

Two more details and it is good to go.

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				## On grant applications

				Our applications on NLnet grants to fund the work on Forgejo are progressing.

dachary commented

2023-03-10 10:51:28 +00:00

s/Our/The/

"Our grant" mean that, in the future, the Forgejo community will be held accountable for how the grant was executed. But the beneficiaries of each grant application are specific groups of individuals / organizations. Forgejo, as a community (us, our) is not a beneficiary of these grants, has no control over them or their implementation.

There is one grant application for which you are the beneficiary and you alone decide what it is and how it relates to Forgejo. There is another grant application for which beneficiaries are yet to be determined, probably @crystal and @earl-warren. I wrote it, sent the application and passed the first hurdle, but I'm not a beneficiary.

s/Our/The/ "Our grant" mean that, in the future, the Forgejo community will be held accountable for how the grant was executed. But the beneficiaries of each grant application are specific groups of individuals / organizations. Forgejo, as a community (us, our) is not a beneficiary of these grants, has no control over them or their implementation. There is one grant application for which you are the beneficiary and you alone decide what it is and how it relates to Forgejo. There is another grant application for which beneficiaries are yet to be determined, probably @crystal and @earl-warren. I wrote it, sent the application and passed the first hurdle, but I'm **not** a beneficiary.

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 11:13:53 +00:00

Poster

Pfft, details 😹

Fixed.

Pfft, details 😹 Fixed.

Ryuno-Ki marked this conversation as resolved

Ryuno-Ki requested review from dachary 2023-03-10 11:14:05 +00:00

dachary referenced this pull request

2023-03-10 12:14:23 +00:00

WIP: monthly update february 2023 #150

earl-warren requested changes 2023-03-10 13:55:39 +00:00

Dismissed

earl-warren left a comment

LGTM without the addition of "In fact, at this point the moderation team is
effectively disbanded. We hope to reestablish it as soon as possible.". It will make it easier
to get approval from the wider Forgejo community.

Thanks for taking the time to work on this: very useful, very time consuming 💙

LGTM without the addition of "In fact, at this point the moderation team is effectively disbanded. We hope to reestablish it as soon as possible.". It will make it easier to get approval from the wider Forgejo community. Thanks for taking the time to work on this: very useful, very time consuming 💙

Ryuno-Ki commented

2023-03-10 19:15:37 +00:00

Poster

Picked up the feedback from @earl-warren and @fsologureng. Thanks!

If this PR passes the review I kindly ask someone else to hit the merge button.
There are personal events I need to attend to and I will only get back earliest Tuesday next week.

Picked up the feedback from @earl-warren and @fsologureng. Thanks! If this PR passes the review I kindly ask someone else to hit the merge button. There are personal events I need to attend to and I will only get back earliest Tuesday next week.

Ryuno-Ki force-pushed wip-2023-02-blog-take-2 from 97c359769e to a8eb15e0ce

2023-03-10 19:16:29 +00:00

Compare

dachary requested changes 2023-03-10 22:57:36 +00:00

Dismissed

dachary left a comment

I approve the content. It needs to be agreed upon by more people before it is published.