Switched to Inter #33
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lhinderberger
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This PR replaces Rubik and Tajawal with the font suggested in Codeberg/Design#18
I'm using the variable-width variant for this PR.
Before and After screenshots are attached. Comments are very welcome.
Quite annoyingly, I had to rename the font to "Codeberg House Font" for this PR, as "Inter" is a Reserved Font Name and the SIL OFL 1.1 says (highly simplified) that Modified Versions cannot use Reserved Font Names and that (again, simplified) distributing only parts of a font constitutes a Modified Version. The alternative would have been to push ~25MB of font data to the repository.
(As always with legal topics: I am not a lawyer)
I like it. Readability does indeed improve in my eyes.
I don't get why the ranaming had to happen. As far as I understand this only is relevant if you distribute the font, not if you use it. Of course serving a webpage can technically be seen as distribution, but in terms of legal sense i think it is fine to just keep using the original name. Especially if people can avoid downloading an exact copy of the font that just has a different name.
Btw, why did you not change the font on the headline "Documentation"?
Using Tajawal and the logo-symbol in that arrangement is a bit problematic in my eyes: while we may want things to lean towards the logo in terms of color and style they can end up being somewhat too close…
Oh, and also thank you for so quickly adopting the guidelines, makes me happy to see them being put to good use :D
Because of Inter being a Reserved Font Name and the legal ambiguity you already pointed out, I like to be on the safe side. We could however just go and ask the developers of the Inter font, if they're okay with us redistributing a part of their font without changing the name.
I considered the site name part of the logo and as you said in the issue at Codeberg/Design, Tajawal remains the logo font, so I didn't change it.
Please elaborate on what you mean with "too close".
Well, thank you for the praise, but that wasn't even my intention 😄
I have not yet adopted the new font, that's why this issue is a WIP. It exists to test-drive Inter and to be merged once Codeberg/Design#18 closes with a decision in favor of Inter as our new house font.
To be honest, I have my issues with the Inter font. I don't think it looks that much nicer than what we already have and the size and legal issues make it unnecessarily hard to work with from the technical side.
Oh, just the issue with the logo font. After discussing that point already in Codeberg/Design and clarifying that Tajawal stays the font, it seemed a bit like a mixed message now to critizise the PR for using Tajawal as the logo font 😉
Also, with the legal question, I'm generally not in favor of prioritizing performance over compliance.
I have to admitt I never thought about this being an issue when applying webfonts. If I understand you creectly that woul dmean that only the homepage of the original developer could make use of that particular font name as any other webpage would technically be redistributing?
Sure. When creating a brand your goal is to create a recognizable combination of shapes, colrs and text that instantly make you go "I know that" – on a very deep level. Repetition plays a great role on that. The more you are noticing the exact recurring brand, the easier you start noticing it in other places.
By having a second variation that uses the mark+symbol combination with the same font and color (slight spacing and fontsize variations aside) you create a second "Codeberg" with the name of "Documentation", which isn't a proper logo, and – given the context – probably will be recognized by people as such. Because they know that "Codeberg" is the actual name, and Documentation is what they are searching for to learn hot to use it.
Still – you create a "non-valid" copy of the logo that you want to consistently be present.
(This is why it is often hammered into peoples heads to not not alter any aspect of the logo at all, too. Like aspect ratio, spacing, recoloring, …)
The usual disclaimer first: I'm not a lawyer, this is not legal advice and this reflects only my personal opinion.
Redistributing an unmodified font ("Original Version") under SIL OFL 1.1 does not automatically require renaming the font, no. But redistributing a Modified Version of the font most of the time does (unless for example the Copyright Holder grants permission to do so) EDIT: IF the copyright owner has specified a Reserved Font Name.
So the question now is, do we ship a Modified Version? Looking at the definition of "Modified Version" in the OFL, I'd personally tend to "yes", because by distributing only the WOFF2 part of the font, we have effectively deleted large parts of the original distribution.
Another interpretation could be the one of "Functional Equivalence", as made in the OFL FAQ - but the authors of the FAQ more or less advise against it. I also do not know how they derived that argumentation from the text of the license.
I recommend to read the OFL 1.1 in full text (it's not very long 😉).
Thank you. So, if I understood you correctly, you say that the Codeberg logo should remain the only real logo, with the sub-sites using only the "mountain", but using Inter as the font for what would then effectively not be their logo but the "main heading"?
It turns out, the Inter project has specified Inter as a Reserved Font Name only a couple of days ago.
I have asked them to remove the RFN again, because it's a breaking change that probably comes as a surprise to most users: https://github.com/rsms/inter/issues/282#issuecomment-679101122
So let's see how that issue develops - maybe the legal problems with the font just disappear :)
@mray My question went a bit under the radar, I'm afraid, so here it is again. ;)
If yes, then the next question would be if it's acceptable to let everything (color, spacing etc.) except the font face of the heading be as it is?
Thinking about it, a way around the whole font name controversy could be to start a new project called for example
Codeberg/Fonts
which serves as our private font hosting page for all Codeberg projects. There, it could potentially be possible to add the fonts that we depend on as git submodules, and host them there centrally, unmodified, in their entirety.That would have the additional advantage of having only one point where fonts get delivered, thus avoiding double downloads.
Taking things one step further, we could (in the future) even encourage Codeberg Pages users to use the fonts hosted there, reducing the probability that people embed Google Fonts and similar services.
To start, this could be a simple pages repo in a dedicated org?
If we don't use submodules for now and manually update the fonts for each new release, yes (some fonts, including Inter, require a build step when cloning them from source).
I think manually managing the fonts at this point is totally okay. In the long run, an automated approach with git submodules would be extra cool 😎
Idea of pages repo is to separate sources (dedicated repo) and delivery content (pages repo)...
True - Then using submodules is of course no problem.
I suggest we create a
codeberg-fonts
organization, mirror the fonts we want to use (that's currently Inter and FontAwesome, in their entirety) and use submodules for the integration source repository. If you're okay with that, I could do that and add you as an admin to the new org.Sounds good. Let me know when you set up the pages there, then we can redirect https://fonts.codeberg.org/ to this org/pages repo.
To give a qualified answer I guess I would need to know a few more facts:
I'm afraid I'm unable to give a correct answer about questions about long-term strategy and positioning of projects/sub-projects, as right now I'm personally not aware of discussions or decisions in that direction.
Maybe @hw knows more? And maybe these questions even need their own discussion, because it's essentialy the question, where we want to go to.
My uneducated guess would be:
Again, that's just my personal uneducated guess. 😉
@hw I have now created the codeberg-fonts organization.
I will go ahead and build the site ASAP.
As for the submodule approach, a quick update: After looking at issues with font licensing (such as the breaking change in Inter licensing or the brand icons in Fontawesome), I now think that it would be better to not mirror the repositories of fonts and to not include them as submodules, but to manually review new releases of the fonts and to write a script that downloads them and applies patches as needed, for example removing the legally questionable brand icons from FontAwesome.
I think that's not ever going to be a problem as long as we don't use the logos. Even given the fact that we use them – fair use would cover it in most cases anyway I guess.
Thanks for your point of view. I didn't think you to could an offical view just like that on all points. But your assessment generally fits my expectation. So without seeing the complete picture it looks like I would try to put everything under one "Codeberg" roof with one logo.
If there were multiple efforts like "Documentation – like https://readthedocs.org/" or "codeberg pages – like netlify" with a seprate codebase that can be applied without gitea, that would be another case.
Regarding your question about a logo that would mean to establish divisions of Codeberg that would consist of the Codeberg logo plus an addition like:
@Codeberg
_PAGES
@Codeberg
_DOCS
@Codeberg
_CHAT
but never:
@Pages
@Docs
@Chat
or even:
@Pages
Codeberg
@Docs
Codeberg
@Chat
Codeberg
The important thing is to leave the original Codeberg mark intact and not replace parts of it with a division replacement.
Does that help?
AFAIK, in German law (which applies to Codeberg) there's no real Fair Use law that's equivalent to what exists for example in the USA. The closest thing I can think of is "Urheberrechtsschranken" which is complex, to put it mildly 😅
Also, while we might not be actively using them, by putting them up on the website we'd still be redistributing them. Which is all it takes to violate copyright, I'm afraid.
So I'd rather remove them. As of right now and as far as I'm aware of, Font Awesome hasn't specified a RFN, so removing parts of the font is much easier 😉
Yes, thank you! 👍 I'm confident that I now have understood your intentions.
I will prepare a new version of the heading, upload it to a separate PR (to not over-burden this PR here even more 😄) and ask for your feedback there.
Concerning redistribution and copyright violation, I think this remains irrellevant as long as you don't even display the logo. If distribution would become an issue for an involved partry my guess would be the first to know would be the font awesome team. Then the fork awesome team, and only then pages that use font awesome.
Since we don't use any such logos and I don't have to remove them I'm happy to ship a smaller font (would it be re-downloaded or used from cache from other site visists btw?)
It seems we're approaching the question of Copyright very differently. Let's agree to disagree on that one. 😉
I'm sorry, I don't understand your question. What do you mean with you dont have to remove them in relation to shipping a smaller font?
Concerning caching: As long as the web server sends the right HTTP headers with the fonts, I think we'll be able to reduce unnecessary re-downloading for the average user, yes.
If you prefer, we can move the technical fonts discussion to https://codeberg.org/codeberg-fonts/codeberg-fonts/issues
There is no realtion. I like that the shipped font gets smaller (faster) - unrelated to that I'm also not the one doing the extra work. So I'm fine no matter what.
Something we should optimize as soon this becomes an issue.
yes!
WIP: Switched to variable-width house font derived from Interto Switched to variable-width house font derived from Inter 2 years agoWith Codeberg Fonts now being operational, I will merge this PR now, minus fixing the heading, which is moved to #44
Switched to variable-width house font derived from Interto Switched to Inter 2 years agofbbac5f91d
into master 2 years agofbbac5f91d
.